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Legendary History Prior to 1st Century BC
Beli Mawr and Llyr Llediath in Welsh Pedigrees
The Bartrum "Welsh Genealogies"
Bartrum's "Pedigrees of the Welsh Tribal Patriarchs"
A study in charting medieval citations
The Evolution of the "Padriarc Brenin" Pedigree
Generational Gaps and the Welsh Laws
Minimum Age for Welsh Kingship in the Eleventh Century
The Lands of the Silures
Catel Durnluc aka Cadell Ddyrnllwg
Ancient Powys
The Royal Family of Powys
The Royal Family of Gwynedd
The 5 Plebian Tribes of Wales
Maxen Wledig of Welsh Legend
Maxen Wledig and the Welsh Genealogies
Anwn Dynod ap Maxen Wledig
Constans I and his 343 Visit to Britain
Glast and the Glastening
Composite Lives of St Beuno
Rethinking the Gwent Pedigrees
The Father of Tewdrig of Gwent
Another Look at Teithfallt of Gwent
Ynyr Gwent and Caradog Freich Fras
Llowarch ap Bran, Lord of Menai
Rulers of Brycheiniog - The Unanswered Questions
Lluan ferch Brychan
The Herbert Family Pedigree
Edwin of Tegeingl and his Family
Angharad, Heiress of Mostyn
Ithel of Bryn in Powys
Idnerth Benfras of Maesbrook
Henry, the Forgotten Son of Cadwgan ap Bleddyn
The Muddled Pedigree of Sir John Wynn of Gwydir
The Mysterious Peverel Family
The Clan of Tudor Trevor
The Other "Sir Roger of Powys"
Ancestry of Ieuaf ap Adda ap Awr of Trevor
The Retaking of Northeast Wales
Hedd Molwynog or Hedd ap Alunog of Llanfair Talhearn
"Meuter Fawr" son of Hedd ap Alunog
The Medieval "redating" of Braint Hir
Aaron Paen ap Y Paen Hen
Welsh Claims to Ceri after 1179
The Battle of Mynydd Carn
Trahaearn ap Caradog of Arwystli
Cadafael Ynfyd of Cydewain
Maredudd ap Robert, Lord of Cedewain
Cadwgan of Nannau
Maredudd ap Owain, King of Deheubarth
What Really Happened in Deheubarth in 1022?
Two Families headed by a Rhydderch ap Iestyn
The Era of Llewelyn ap Seisyll
Cynfyn ap Gwerystan, the Interim King
The Consorts and Children of Gruffudd ap Llewelyn
The 1039 Battle at Rhyd y Groes
The First Wife of Bleddyn ap Cynfyn
Hywel ap Gronwy of Deheubarth
The Brief Life of Gruffudd ap Maredudd
The Other Gwenwynwyn
Eunydd son of Gwenllian
Sandde Hardd of Mortyn
The Floruit of Einion ap Seisyllt
The Enigmatic Elystan Glodrydd
Cowryd ap Cadfan of Dyffryn Clwyd
Owain ap Cadwgan and Nest ferch Rhys - An Historic Fiction?
The "sons" of Owain ap Cadwgan ap Bleddyn
The Betrayal by Meirion Goch Revisited
Gwyn Ddistain, seneschal for Llewelyn Fawr
The Men of Lleyn - How They Got There
Trahaearn Goch of Lleyn
Einion vs Iestyn ap Gwrgan - The Conquest of Glamorgan
Dafydd Goch ap Dafydd - His Real Ancestry
Thomas ap Rhodri - Father of Owain "Lawgoch"
The "Malpas" Family in Cheshire
Einion ap Celynin of Llwydiarth
Marchweithian, Lord of Is Aled, Rhufoniog
Osbwrn Wyddel of Cors Gedol
Bradwen of Llys Bradwen in Meirionydd
Ednowain ap Bradwen
Sorting out the Gwaithfoeds
Three Men called Iorwerth Goch "ap Maredudd"
The Caradog of Gwynedd With 3 Fathers
Who Was Sir Robert Pounderling?
Eidio Wyllt - What Was His Birthname?
The Legendary Kingdom of Seisyllwg
The Royal Family of Ceredigion
Llewelyn ap Hoedliw, Lord of Is Cerdin
The Ancestry of Owain Glyndwr
Welsh Ancestry of the Tudor Dynasty
Gruffudd ap Rhys, the Homeless Prince
The Children of Lord Rhys
Maredudd Gethin ap Lord Rhys
The 'Next Heir' of Morgan of Caerleon
Pedigree of the ancient Lords of Ial
The Shropshire Walcot Family
Pedigree of "Ednowain Bendew II"
Pedigree of Cynddelw Gam

#7 - SEISYLL OF MEIRIONYDD
 
       This is the pedigree Bartrum offers for Seisyll:
 
       "Seisyllt arglwydd Meirionydd ap Ednywain ap Eunydd bach"
 
       His notes for the pedigree read:
 
       "Born c. 1170.  His son, Einion, was living in the time of Llywelyn the Great. (Pen 236 p. 111 quoted RWM i.1061-2 and PF i.98-99).  Einion was the ancestor of the family of Pugh of Mathafarn (see DWB) and other families in Meirionydd.  He is sometimes said to be the brother of Llywelyn (b. c. 970) ap Seisyll (e.g. Dwnn i.295, ii.107).  This is of course absurd, but it is possible that the pedigree given here belongs to Seisyll the father of Llywelyn; see note to [thye pedigree of Eunydd Bach].  There seems to be no definite information as to where Llywelyn ap Seisyll came from."
 
         While we agree the pedigree proposed is correct for this Seisyll, and his family constitutes a cousin line of the Peredur brothers both descended from Gwyddno ap Cadwaladr, we date his birth c. 1080.  His son was the first Einion ap Seisyll born c. 1110 and contemporary with Owain Cyfeiliog[1].  That Einion had a grandson, also named Einion ap Seisyll, born c. 1175 who did live in the time of Llewelyn Fawr.  The Pugh family of Mathafarn has both Einions in their ancestry, being descended from Huw ap Ieuan ap Dafydd Llwyd the noted bard.
 
          It is certainly absurd to cast Einion ap Seisyll as a brother of Llewelyn ap Seisyll, but equally as absurd to think the latter Seisyll is the man in the proposed pedigree.  He was king of Powys and Gwynedd, dying in 1023, long before Seisyll ap Ednowain was born.  We have argued that he was a member of the First Powys Dynasty[2].
 
           While it is likely Seisyll ap Ednowain was Lord of Ystumanner commote in Meirionydd which had its eastern border on the Dyfi river[3], during his lifetime the Gwynedd kings were also Lords of Meirionydd.  His full pedigree is:
 
                                   830  Gwyddno ap Cadwaladr
                                                l
                                      860  Cynyr
                                                l
                                     895  Clydno
                                                l
                                       925  Idris
                                                l
                                     960  Iswallt
                                                l
                                    990  Brochwel
                                                l
                                  1020  Eunydd Bach
                                                l
                                  1050  Ednowain
                                                l
                                   1080  Seisyll
 
 
NOTES:
[1]  See the paper "The Floruit of Einion ap Seisyll" elsewhere on this site
[2]  See the paper "End of the Powys Dynasty" elsewhere on this site
[3]  The Einion ap Seisyll of c. 1110 took his part of his father's lands to Cyfeiliog about 1070 to escape the Gwynedd man who inherited the Lordship of Meirionydd following the death of King Owain Gwynedd.